Knesset member demands modest dress

by Reb Yidlicious [➚] · Friday, June 18th, 2004

Haaretz reports,

Knesset Speaker Rivlin to demand modest dress from female Knesset aides…

It seems that Washingtonienne story is coming full circle.

20 Responses to “Knesset member demands modest dress”

someone’s got to say it

how about Burqas

—Babylonian · June 18th, 2004 at 2:06 pm
hE MUST BE ONE OF THOSE HORNY ORTHODOX GUYS

—Orlando · June 18th, 2004 at 4:37 pm
Women MKs upstairs behind the grill then.

—jerry · June 19th, 2004 at 2:11 pm
Actually Orlando he is not Orthodox. He just has some morals and values in this immoral world.

—Shalom · June 20th, 2004 at 2:52 am
Can someone tell me if there’s a dress code in Congress?

Too easy to not let a chance go by to claim ‘ religious/dos coercion’, right?

—josh · June 20th, 2004 at 4:07 am
Congressional Page Dress Code

Boys’ Dress Code
The dress required for males is a navy blazer, long sleeved white shirt, dark gray slacks, dark socks, dark shoes and a standard issue tie.

Girls’ Dress Code
The dress required for females is a navy blazer, long sleeved white blouse, dark gray skirt or dark gray pants, dark shoes, appropriate hose and a standard issue tie.

Standard Issue Ties
The ties are provided during orientation and are navy with red and white stripes. Pages will be charged for any uniform tie requested over the one allotted.

—Reb Yidlicious · June 20th, 2004 at 8:17 am
When Israel was founded, its people were poor, simple, and direct, and so could not afford fancy suits, or airconditioning (when it existed, which was not then), not would they want to.
They rejected the puritanism of old as well as the bourgeois coquetterie.
So suits and ties were rare while shorts and sleeveless shirts common.
As a result, Israelis are devoid of style when it comes to clothing, particularly when compared to other Mediterraneans (like italians, for example), and the idea of a dress code, is not as obvious there as it is in the West.

Mr. Rubi Rivlin, is definitely a secular hedonist, but he also bears the refined European legacy most Israelis lack (because, well, we’re not Europeans), and he’d like to introduce some form to the national legislature, which is not a bad idea in itself, just not much in tune with the local mentality.

However, the knesset has more urgent issues in need of mending than the clothes of its workers, and despite conventional wisdom, strictness in clothing is not correlated with clean government, as one can note by a cursory observation of many Western countries.

—R. Shalom Shabazzy · June 21st, 2004 at 12:45 am
R. Shalom,
Do work in Israel and if so, do you work everyday in an environment with women wearing sleeveless form-fitting shirts?
I agree that you shouldn’t judge people by what they wear, but maybe some co-workers don’t appreciate if someone else wants to feel ‘sexy’?
I disagree with the ‘more urgent issues’. First, the knesset has to mend itself before they can mend the people. I also don’t think that the time is right for everyone to wear suits, but a certain standard agreed upon by all (especially the woman and union heads) could be reasonable.
Two years ago, most schools in Israel went back to ‘uniforms’ which is actually a t-shirt with the school logo on it (different colours available). The rationale was to dismiss from the school the tension from frequent fashion trends/brands and to stop having the girls come dressed as harlots.

—josh · June 21st, 2004 at 4:09 am
Josh
For the time being, co-workers who dont appreciate what their colleagues wear have to deal with it.
While it would be reasonable to agree on a certain dress standard (as I wrote: “is not a bad idea in itself”), it is not likely to happen soon.
We have been neglecting more important issues such as eudcation, health-care, employment, the quality of the air we breath, product safety norms, etc.
After we re address all these and other problems (along with the conflict problem, for it isn’t going away either) perhaps we’ll have the time to dress with taste.

The knesset has been becoming a place for practicing plutocracy and corruption, it is not due to how MKs and their assistants dress. So yes, there are more urgent issues there.

As for the school example, it is irrelevent for our case which involves adults, not minors.

—R. Shalom Shabazzy · June 21st, 2004 at 5:51 am
Once again we must call Nietzsche into the room:

You cannot put laws on things which belong to the aesthetic realm. Well, let me take that back – of course you CAN, but the implications are that a law banning the wearing of kippot to workplace is entirely legitimate. THis is, of course, the situation, unless you show me that one aesthetic judgment is different from another. Then again, in that case it wouldn’t be aesthetic judgment anymore.

—Asaf Shtull-Trauring · June 21st, 2004 at 6:05 am
Come on, R. Shalom, are you really trying to claim that the Knesset can’t institute a dress code AND continue to ignore public interest legislation?

—Ariel Beery · June 21st, 2004 at 11:02 am
You cannot put laws on things which belong to the aesthetic realm. Well, let me take that back – of course you CAN, but the implications are that a law banning the wearing of kippot to workplace is entirely legitimate. THis is, of course, the situation, unless you show me that one aesthetic judgment is different from another.

Um, logic? You’ll note that many Canadian ice hockey teams wear uniforms on the ice. Some fancy Canadian restaurants insist that their male patrons wear blazers and ties. On the other hand, Canadian girls are still permitted to wear hujub at public schools. I have yet to meet someone who finds this confusing.

—8opus · June 21st, 2004 at 3:44 pm
Ariel Beery
“Come on, R. Shalom, are you really trying to claim that the Knesset can’t institute a dress code AND continue to ignore public interest legislation?”

Don’t claim it ‘can’t', I say that based on prior Israeli record on such matters ‘it is not likely’ that it would.

—R. Shalom Shabazzy · June 21st, 2004 at 5:04 pm
No one is causing offence by asking for a professional environment to remain as professional as possible. Whatever the history of Israeli fashion (or lack of), the fact is that any other office around the country has some form of dress-code and all present Mks can afford a decent pair of slacks or a skirt. Asking men and women alike not to come into the Knesset wearing sleeveless tops or shorts (be they pants or skirts) is not discriminating against anyone, rather it would promote the feeling of professionalism and seriousness. The anti-religious lobby would use any excuse to denounce the orthodox Mks, but unfortunately here they havenâ€™t a leg to stand on!

—Yaffa · June 22nd, 2004 at 3:25 am
8opus – laws are different from dress codes in a soccer team. unless the government IS just another soccer team. In such case, i guess my libertarian inclinations do make sense

—Asaf Shtull-Trauring · June 22nd, 2004 at 7:44 am
It’s about time we issue those jumpsuits we’re keeping in storage for the day-after-bio/chem bombings (with attached hoods) to all citizens. Unfortunately, we’ll also need to start arresting those who dare wear anything else (or fail to keep their hood in place).

As one’s clothing most certainly is directly related to a person’s level of righteousness, we should violently enforce this rule with the usual stone-throwing tactics. Pummel and bash these heretical self-haters into ethical correctness.

If people start abusing clothes, it’s really the only reasonable choice, lest we (once again) tempt G-d’s wrath and our water fails to boil and our crops wither and portfolios plummet. Showing necks and elbows can, quite literaly, kill.

Arrest the evil clothing abusers while we still have time.

.rob adams

—rob adams · June 22nd, 2004 at 9:08 am
8opus – laws are different from dress codes in a soccer team. unless the government IS just another soccer team. In such case, i guess my libertarian inclinations do make sense

You’re still not making much sense. This time you seem confused by the difference between laws that regulate all of society, and laws that act as internal policy guidelines on the workplaces that the government runs.

Noone has to play for a soccer team. Noone has to take a job as a clerk in the Knesset. Their choice to do either runs up against certain dress codes. Those dress codes do not apply outside the soccer team or the Knesset, respectively.

—8opus · June 22nd, 2004 at 9:17 am
Well yes, 8opus. I was talking about law in general not dress code in workplace. On the other hand, the knesset and other governmental jobs are a totally different issue than non-governmental jobs.

—Asaf Shtull-Trauring · June 22nd, 2004 at 10:17 am
Well yes, 8opus. I was talking about law in general not dress code in workplace.

Ah — I misunderstood. That is an interesting topic. Not the one being discussed here, mind you (this was about Knesset Speaker Rivlin to demand modest dress from female Knesset aides). But interesting. Sorry.

—8opus · June 23rd, 2004 at 10:20 pm
ok – so here’s another off topic post.

I think I just saw the other night the washingtonienne….

—Asaf Shtull-Trauring · June 27th, 2004 at 5:20 pm

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