Israel To Revoke Palestinian Work Permits?
“You shall not oppress a stranger for you know the heart of a stranger as you were slaves in the land of Egypt.” (Exodus 23:9)
“You shall not abuse a needy and destitute laborer, whether a fellow countryman or a stranger in one of the communities of your land.” (Deuteronomy 24:14)
Like many of you, I am somebody whose family came to America as refugees from discrimination against Jews. That is the root of my first consciousness of and interest in civil rights. From the 1930’s through the 1950’s, anti-Semitism was blatant in America with companies advertising “No Jews need apply” or “Protestants only.” and the Jewish community has worked very hard to solve that.
So when I read this quote on a hokey right wing website today from Chief of Staff Lt. Gen. Moshe Ya’alon, my jaw literally dropped:
“The goal is to stop Palestinians from working in Israel by 2008,” Ya’alon told the Low-Intensity Conflict warfare counter-terrorism [LIC-2005] conference on Tuesday.
The article continues to say
Chief of Staff Lt. Gen. Moshe Ya’alon said Israel no longer maintains a policy of encouraging Palestinian employment. Ya’alon said the government has been phasing out the number of jobs available to Palestinians from the West Bank and Gaza Strip in Israel. By 2008, Israel would institute a complete ban on the employment of Palestinians, Middle East Newsline reported.
I don’t find the website to be a very reliable source, and I sincerely hope they’re wrong.
HOLY FLURKING SHNIT!!! AAAAAAAAAH !!!!Actually this is the best news on this whole year. I mean its like fantastic.
and you know what Johny i read this on Haaretz yesterday.and you know as a news sourse Haaretz quite reliable. ha ha ha ha .
John, I don’t think it is a fair or accurate comparison. Jews in America whether in the 1930’s or today were and are committed to the success and flourishing of the United States. The same cannot be said of the residents of the West Bank or Gaza (non-Jewish ones anyways)
I’m not interested in parsing the exact number of Palis who do or do not recognize Israel’s existence or wish it ill, but it is just not the same situation as Jews in America. #1, Jews were or were to become citizens of the US. Palestinians are citizens of another country (entity, whatever you want to call the P.A.) It’s like a US Government representative saying they want to limit the number of Canadian or Mexican citizens workign in the US. There is nothing wrong with that.
You are usually sharper than this, I’m not sure what the point is of the melodramatic “my family came to America as refugees from discrimination against Jews.” Take a look around you, ALL of our families came to America (those whose families are here) to have a better life and escape from the restricions in the old country placed in us as Jews.
I just read it on Drudge report as well. This is actually a step in the right direction! Let them learn to appriciate the opportunities that were available to them in Israel… Let them gofind work in Egypt, Jordan, Syria… I agree whole heartdly with Sausage no comparison… what so ever!!
Check out honestreporting.com. They uncover the truth behind such news stories.
John the Liberator: How could you have missed this one? A fucking Jewish ‘fatwa’ calling for the death of Sharon. Civil War?! An end to the Zionist state! Hooray!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wor…
Oh learned John who quotes the Torah, how about explaining:
‘When you cross the Yarden to the land of Canaan, you must drive out all of the inhabitants of the land before you. You must destroy all their carved stones, and demolish all their cast metal idols and tear down all their altars.'” Numbers 33:50-52
To quote picked quotes out of context – that’s easy. To learn the whole thing that’s another story.
Its time for you to start learning.
And if i thought Canda should fall of the face of the earth, that they are lower than scum people, my greatest enemies, the worst evil in the world, why the hell would i want to work for them?? I guess when push comes to shove and you realized your goverment failed you and brainwashed you and took all your money to give to their wives in Paris…Israel…. i mean Canda doesnt look so bad.
How is an independent Palestine supposed to emerge by keeping the Palestinian economy dependent upon Israel?
How is an independent Palestine supposed to emerge by keeping the Palestinian economy dependent upon Israel?
Who knows, but where else are Palis going to work? Jordan or Lebanaon? Seems the Palis wore out their welcome in those countries a while ago. Palestinians need Israel for the labor opportunities, and Israel needs the Palestinians for a market for their goods.
“Where else are Palis going to work? Jordan or Lebanaon? Seems the Palis wore out their welcome in those countries a while ago.”
They wore out there welcome in Israel a long time ago, too. I guess its up to the Pan-Arabists to figure this one out, As far as Israel goes, its not our problem.
hey last of the jewish n-words.
a “fatwa” is any muslim religious decree, not a call for someone’s death. saying that you shouldn’t eat some new food because it has pig fat in it, for example, would be a fatwa. word to the wise.
alexbmn wrote: “this is the best news on this whole year”
I guess if you want to exacerbate the conflict and create new enemies where there were none before, then it’s good news
Sausage: “…but where else are Palis going to work?”
I dunno… Palestine, perhaps? The international community that is so passionate about getting an emergent Palestine up and running can boost Palestinian commerce and industry, and support joint Palestinian-Israeli businesses in the industrial zones along the border. Now that there is a serious Palestinian leadership taking shape, they can even try and keep the Hamas/Jihad/Martyrs’ mortars from landing on places like Karmi. We can all do a whole lot more (especially those of us who consider ourselves peace and human rights activists) to put some pressure on interested third parties to start acting like responsible interested third parties, instead of just sitting around their human rights conferences bitching about “powerful Jewish lobbies,” and such.
“a “fatwa” is any muslim religious decree, not a call for someone’s death. saying that you shouldn’t eat some new food because it has pig fat in it, for example, would be a fatwa”
Hey Sam that’s why I said a ‘fatwa calling for the death of Sharon’. If I was ignorant of the irrelevant point you feel compelled to make, my wording would have been redundant, no? So “for example” if I was talking about a ‘fatwa’ against eating a new food, i would have said “a fatwa against eating a new food”. Hey, that’s what you said!
Thank you for blessing me with your learning Sam, you never fail to condescend…
On Joe Schmo’s comment a few lines above – a couple of responses
1) Our people have picked lines out of context from the Torah for thousands of years for the purpose of making a point. Ever hear of Midrash?
2) Anyone who connects the verses in the Torah about what we are supposed to do to the Canaanites as having bearing on Palestinians is being silly. The Canaanites were (according to the Torah) child-sacrificing idol worshippers. Palestinians are fellow monotheists who share our reverence for the Patriarchs and Moses. Even if they were idol worshippers, look at Maasechet Avodah Zarah. There’s rules about what days you can’t trade with them (meaning that we can trade with them in general) and nothing about how to carry out the mass destruction called for in the Torah.
Be more cautious with your own sources before dissing others’ ignorance.
Simon-
On point one, Midrash is not picking lines out of context. The canonical Midrashim are themselves considered an aspect of the accurate, in-context understanding of the Torah. (This is the Orthodox view, of course; but even in the most secular viewpoint, the Midrashim were written by experts in Jewish thought and law, so their writings shouldn’t be compared with every yahoo ignorant of most of the sources cherry-picking to make his political point.)
On the second point, I’m going to assume that Joe Schmo realizes that halachically, the rules regarding the Canaanites don’t apply to the Palestinians. But hashkafically, he’s right to use those verses to refute one-sided quotes regarding treatment of non-Jews. Clearly, though, the relevant sources respecting how to deal with the Palestinians are those regarding self-defense.
In light of the Palestinians’ recruiting of young suicide bombers and targeting of Jewish children, I thought it was…unfortunate that you mentioned the Canaanites as child sacrificers.
The area betwen the fence and the green line, the “seam zone,” will contain industrial parks where 120,000 Palestinians can work in israeli-owned businesses w/out ever having to enter into israel
Yes J thank you.
Simon, The Midrash never claimed that they were reading things according to their literal meaning. They often attempted to show hints from the Torah to ideas that they already know to be accurate without those quotes. There is no attempt to hide that. Not so with our friend John, anyone his quote would think that what he is saying is in the quote.
Furthermore, although the arabs are not idol-worshippers they want to take Israel away from the Jewish people. That is enough reason to move them out.
Hi J – yes the frum view is that all came from Mt. Sinai. But please – there are Midrash using the Psalm we say during Tachanun to prove that David HaMelech had sex ten or more times a night (‘my sheets are soaked…’) I say this not to disrespect Hazal – Midrash shows their beautiful imagination, facility with use of language, and incredible pre-CD rom knowledge of Tanach, and I believe that they are divinely inspired. But one only need peek at Artscroll’s Midrash-based ‘translation’ of Shir HaShirim to show the dangers of taking Midrash as an ‘accurate in-context’ understanding of texts.
Gut Hodesh,
SF
Finally, Israel is showing some sense.
But why wait until 2008?
Kick them all out now, the ungrateful, murdering bastards.
I dunno… Palestine, perhaps? The international community that is so passionate about getting an emergent Palestine up and running can boost Palestinian commerce and industry, and support joint Palestinian-Israeli businesses in the industrial zones along the border.
You’re right, except that the kind of infrastructure needed to support a modern economy will not just happen overnight. Look at Israel’s tortured economic growth through the 1950’s. The Palestinians may save themselves some grief by not going the socialism route as Israel did, but they still have a long way to go before they expunge their culture of corruption and the other pathologies in their society that will have to be faced. So the reality is that in the short term (first few years of statehood at the least), the Palestinians will have to rely on Israel for employment. If they want an airport or a seaport, they are gonna have ot prove conclusively to Israel and the int’l community that terrorism has been cleared form their society. I am for a Palestinian state, but I’m not willing to see the Palis have unfettered access to arms and such while they still have yet to deal conclusively with Hamas and the terrorist elements in their society.
mr brown,
how is this any different than stopping mexican nationals from working inside the US? Or Turks or Roma in the EU? And these exist without a mix of jihadis.
Further, I believe working in Israel as a non Israeli Palestinian, should be tied into peace negotiations. Surely, no other country is expected to grant work permits for the people they are at war with.
yu wrote: [i]”how is this any different than stopping mexican nationals from working inside the US? Or Turks or Roma in the EU? “[/i]
There a number of differences. In the case of the USA and the EU, the governments are acting to protect their own workers from undocumented non-citizens, and there’s no intention to specifically discriminate against any race or nationality.
Whereas in Israel, the specific stated intention is to discriminate against Palestinians. It’s not a general policy to eliminate undocumented non-citizens, as Israel has imported an estimated 300,000 “guest workers” (more than 5% of the total population) from places like Thailand, the Philippines, China, Africa and Eastern Europe. It’s only against Palestinians.
“Foreign workers have been widely employed in Israel since the 1980s. In the early ’90s, after Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin barred most Palestinians from working inside Israel, foreign workers started arriving in large numbers. Due to closures and security concerns associated with the first and especially the second intifada, Israel began using foreign labor to replace Palestinian workers. In this way, contractors and industrialists gained an even cheaper work force.”
Jewish Currents
“In the case of the USA and the EU, the governments are acting to protect their own workers from undocumented non-citizens, and there’s no intention to specifically discriminate against any race or nationality.”
Huh? Of course there is discrimination against certain nationalities. Canadians have an easier time moving to USA than Mexicans. For some nationalities (I believe Mexico is included) you need a transit visa just to land into an American airport, even if you’re heading to another country and never step outside the airport.
“In this way, contractors and industrialists gained an even cheaper work force”
There’s also a significant bonus: you can be fairly sure that your Thai employee won’t blow up your kids on the way home.
If you support a Palestinian state this is great news. Why? Because no Palestinian state can be viable if it relies on an economy driven by its citizens working in Israel. Hence, it is good for an emerging Pal state’s economy as well as Israel’s economy.
So either you really are a right-wing fundamentalist or, more likely, and common to many of the socialist left, don’t know basic economics.
Of course this should be a first step and Israel needs to stop importing foreign workers (as well as shutting down the sex trade) and find a solution to the foreign workers already here.
The early Zionists saw it as vital for the emerging Jewish society, that all labour be performed by Jews, and not be Arabs. It wasn’t becasue they were chauvanists, but rather the opposite. They didn’t want Israel to be a bourgeois society that depended on a lower class to do the dirty work. The whole point of their Zionism, was to get Jews to do some heavy physical work, and redeem themselves int he process.
Identifying with their ideals, I would heartilly support a movement that wanted to replace Arab labour with Jewish labour. But all that’s going to happen now is the replacement of Palestinians with Fillipinos or Thai workers.
So now, Israelis may have more security, but the worthy ideals of ‘Jewish labour’ were lost long ago.
Ezra you are right.
Israel got major psychological problems.
Importing new Non-Jews to only give more grief in the future.
Unbelievable – their stupidity knows no bounds…
Sorry to disappoint y’all,
but since Yaalon has essentially been fired, take everything that he says with a grain of salt and then wait until he removes his uniform and spills his real opinion.
Sharon’s ‘disengagement’ plan guarantees specific numbers of workers entering Israel and increases that number as time goes by.
Amazing.
When Israelis were employing Palestinian workers (and raising their standard of living above that of almost every other Arab country), they were accused of being ruthless capitalists, perpetuating the occupation for the sake of Marxist exploitation.
When Israelis don’t employ Palestinian workers, they are accused of discrimination.
For some people, Israel can’t do right, so long as it exists.
oh come on.
Hey Sam that’s why I said a ‘fatwa calling for the death of Sharon’. If I was ignorant of the irrelevant point you feel compelled to make, my wording would have been redundant, no? So “for example” if I was talking about a ‘fatwa’ against eating a new food, i would have said “a fatwa against eating a new food”. Hey, that’s what you said!
Thank you for blessing me with your learning Sam, you never fail to condescend…
sorry if you thought i was condescending but your meaning wasn’t obvious. you could’ve just meant a fatwa calling for sharon’s death, as opposed to a fatwa calling for someone else’s death. i appreciate being the target of your usual bitterness and snarkiness however.
also, the fact is that you posted a link to a jewish rabbi calling for someone’s death, and called that a jewish fatwa. i don’t recall you posting on any of the recent controversies, relating to wigs or water for example, and calling those “jewish fatwas.” those are just halakhic arguments or rulings. calling for someone’s death, now that’s a fatwa. or so it seemed until you revealed your true depth of knowledge.
Sam the Jewish Fatwa Police:
“or so it seemed until you revealed your true depth of knowledge.’
Are you 12?
Simon can you get me a source (chapter or section) so that I can look up the midrash that you mentioned?
as a matter of fact i am. you have something against twelve-year-olds?
Actually Fatwah is synonimous with Halachic ruling
A fatwa (Arabic: فتو&# 1609;) plural ‘fataawa’, is a legal pronouncement in Islam, issued by a religious law specialist on a specific issue. Usually a fatwa is issued at the request of an individual or a judge to settle a question where fiqh, Islamic jurisprudence, is unclear. A scholar capable of issuing fataawa is known as a Mufti.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F…
“Actually Fatwah is synonimous with Halachic ruling”
Are either of you capable of understanding that I never disputed this fact? I merely refered to a Rabbi’s “fatwa” calling for the death of Sharon. The meaning of my post was quite clear and I never suggested that all fatwas were concerned with murder.
Yikes.