Oh, For Christ's Sake! Apostate Blasts Heeb As Obstacle For Unsaved Souls
Not one to turn the other cheek after Heeb hilariously slammed him after his conversion to Messianism (while he was still getting gigs at unknowing synagogues and Jewish youth groups) in the NY Post and the Forward, 50 Shekel, the Christian artist formerly known as a Jewish parody rapper, is leading a boycott of the anti-Christ itself, Heeb Magazine.
This “True Jew” only has the community’s best interests at heart, of course.
“I am asking you to please contact any store(Tower Records, Borders, Barnes & Noble, etc.) that carries this magazine and ask them to pull it off of their shelves ASAP. Some people criticized me for being a believer in Yeshua (Jesus) and how I am such a bad example to children for reading God’s Complete Word, yet this magazine has been out and even the unsaved Jewish community has NOT EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT HOW THIS IS GOING TO SCAR THEIR CHILDREN FOR LIFE.” […] I’m glad to be on God’s side as a True Jew a/k/a Messianic Jew. We don’t do such things and that’s because we are True Jews after all. From a reailty [sic] standpoint, I don’t see how there will be a Heeb Magazine Issue #10. They should get shut down permanently. Surprisingly, the unsaved Jewish world has not complained and took action to protect their children and God’s Word…I wonder why […] Now you understand how much I am all about raising a new Jew generation to know God in Truth and that means knowing Yeshua (Jesus) Ha’Mashiach.”
Always one to observe even the more stringent aspects of Jewish Law, Fifty dutifully notes that, “They have an astrology page, which by the way, God forbids in The Tanakh.” Come on 50, stop the hate. One love G-d, yo.
[Update] 50 Shekel smears Jewschool and David Kelsey on his website, decrying us for, among other things, our t-shirts. Oh, the horror! —Mo.
jeeeezus im sick of hearing about this silly prick. he needs to stop talking in public. he was a joke before his new found views..now he’s just even more of a joke. but not a funny one. a shitty one which leaves a horrible taste in your mouth.
One wonders how much influence 50 Shekel actually has; like does it even matter that he’s “boycotting” Heeb? I wish I could also point out the hypocrisy of calling oneself a “true Jew” while rejecting the worship of one, incorporeal, indivisible God, but something tells me it wouldn’t make a difference. If 50 Shekel really cares about the Jewish community, maybe he should make the jump into real Christianity (or get back to real Judaism) and stop supporting the deceptive, manipulative Messianic Jewish community.
Also, in line with danny… I’m sick of 50, and others like him, complaining about being criticized for their beliefs. If you’re gonna claim to be Jewish, you better be prepared to be critiqued by the Jewish community. We don’t mess with Christian theology or other groups’ beliefs, but other Jews (including self-proclaimed Jews) are fair game, so if you can’t stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Especially when you’re the one calling other Jews “unsaved” and promoting a non-Jewish book as scripture. 😛
’50 Shekel’ played the Jewish community like a fiddle. I guarantee you that he was a secret J.C. freak all along, and he only faked his ‘conversion’ to further the missionary agenda. He grew up in a mixed Xtian/Jewish home, which almost always means he grew up a Xtian.
He’s a liar, which should surprise nobody because deception is at the core of the missionaries game.
messianic jews are jut a bunch of bull..a waste of time whoever they are
This mental case should keep his two pennies to himself. He is the Daniel Burros of our generation. He should start reading scientific books and he will find out there never was a messiah.He was brainwashed to change his belief just like some people in their highest state of anxiety experience.He is obsessive compulsive over something that never existed. The man needs to grow up.
Please note: Another reason that I mention all of this is that I intro’d my fanbase of all ages, including 12 year old kids and above and below to Heeb a while ago…and never expected Heeb to turn massively pornographic and misguide the youth to believe that porn and Torah belong on the same page. If people have an objection to my timely responsible stance regarding this criminal matter of Heeb peddling pornography to children and even adults, they must be out of their minds. To the saved people out there (Jews & gentiles), “We really gotta be praying for Heeb’s salvation right now as well as those innocent people who have just unknowingly been exposed to Torah porn when receiving this in the mail or purchasing it at a store without a XXX Warning Sticker on it.” This is so wrong. I can’t believe I’m one of the only people stepping up to protect kids from this stuff and stating that Torah porn is absolutely WRONG.
50 who?
Wasn’t Tiorquemada as Jew as this 50 Shekel bloke?
Hey ’50’. Heeb doesn’t claim to be a Torah publication, it claims to be a ‘new Jew’ publication. I don’t agree with all of the content either, but you shouldn’t be talking bro.
Your little website has a ‘warning’ of ‘Rabbinical Advisory, True Jewish Lyrics’.. which you know good and well isn’t true. All REAL rabbis do not approve of anything you say. (and no your goy minister friends who call themselves rabbis don’t count).
Oh, and SAVED? Yes, people need to be saved from deceptive MISSIONARIES LIKE YOU. Teaching people to worship a foreign diety is more dangerous than anything else facing us today. You are guilty of that ‘homie’.
yo shek … how could yashki be moshiach? the prophets said moshiach would come with the ingathering of the exiles. jesus (if the new testament is to be believed) is responsible for the dispersion of the jewish people from israel. he brought the wrath of rome upon us.
moshiach’s supposed to bring peace and the world to come. all jesus brought was one inquisition, crusade and pogrom after another. he fails to fulfill the prophecies.
Actually, may be 30 shekels is an EOZ plant to expose how silly the Missionaries are.
Wow, mobi, you finally did it. you finally disproved that jesus is the mesiah. This should put an end to that belief once and for all. Whats up next for you? Proving the torah was written by god?
50 Shekel has a heart for G-d and those who seek Him with their whole hearts will find Him. G-d bless 50 Shekel.
I hear that all Messianic Jewish rappers carry knives. Boycott *that*, schmuck.
I think 50 is using heeb as a platform to sell his junk.
first of all, the readership of heeb is maybe as much as 50’s pseudoname and I’ll bet not one is under college age.
#2. The new testament is similiar to someone painting targets around darts that , problem is even the xtians admitted their testament to be false. the main problem is that with xtianity claiming to uphold the Tanakh as evidence to its truth, it confounds itself and all it’s claims, and condemns its own doctrines.
We can easily see that the Torah designates ISRAEL as G-d’s people FOREVER. ” And THE PPL OF ISRAEL shall keep the SHABBATH for their GENERATIONS, a covenant FOREVER…” Shemot 31:16-17
now….
Matthew (1:22-23) claims ” now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of j. by the prophet saying ‘behold a virgin shall be with child and shall bring forth a son’ ”
this is a misquote from ISAIH 7.14, ISAIH says YOUNG WOMAN (ALAMAH) not virgin (BETULA)
….Such a huge miracle such as a virgin birth should have been declared in clear words and in the mouths of all the people, yet PETER and PAUL don’t even mention a virgin birth, this should have been their biggest testimony…
In actuallity, ISAIH is speaking to AHAZ, king of Judah, ISAIH gave him a sign that his enemies will fall before him in the next few years “behold, the young woman (your wife) will concieve and bear a son and you shall call him Immanuel (G-d is with us)…. for before the child shall know to refuse evil and choose good, the land which distresses you shall be rid of both her kings”
this means before the child is weaned his enemies will be destroyed.
what connection is there between this and an imaginary virgin birth 600 YEARS LATER?
The xtian apologists actually admit these verses are said in regard to AHAZ, after 2000 YEARS, the REVISED STANDARD EDITION OF THE holy bible approved by the National Council of the CHurches of Christ in the USA, was published in 1954, and the word ‘virgin’ in ISAIH was replaced with ‘young woman’, but the fraud of mathew 1;22-23 still stands a a momument forever to the MISINTERPRETATION upon which the whole STORY was erected.
So PAUL and PETER never mentioned this virgin birth, the revised edition of the ‘scriptures’ admits ISAIH said ‘young woman’ so where do the xtians stand now? on blind faith….
I think 50 is using heeb as a platform to sell his junk.
first of all, the readership of heeb is maybe as much as 50’s pseudoname and I’ll bet not one is under college age.
#2. The new testament is similiar to someone painting targets around darts that missed their mark, problem is even the xtians admitted their testament to be false. and with xtianity claiming to uphold the Tanakh as evidence to its truth, it confounds itself and all it’s claims, and condemns its own doctrines.
We can easily see that the Torah designates ISRAEL as G-d’s people FOREVER. ” And THE PPL OF ISRAEL shall keep the SHABBATH for their GENERATIONS, a covenant FOREVER…” Shemot 31:16-17
now….
Matthew (1:22-23) claims ” now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of j. by the prophet saying ‘behold a virgin shall be with child and shall bring forth a son’ ”
this is a misquote from ISAIH 7.14, ISAIH says YOUNG WOMAN (ALAMAH) not virgin (BETULA)
….Such a huge miracle such as a virgin birth should have been declared in clear words and in the mouths of all the people, yet PETER and PAUL don’t even mention a virgin birth, this should have been their biggest testimony…
In actuallity, ISAIH is speaking to AHAZ, king of Judah, ISAIH gave him a sign that his enemies will fall before him in the next few years “behold, the young woman (your wife) will concieve and bear a son and you shall call him Immanuel (G-d is with us)…. for before the child shall know to refuse evil and choose good, the land which distresses you shall be rid of both her kings”
this means before the child is weaned his enemies will be destroyed.
what connection is there between this and an imaginary virgin birth 600 YEARS LATER?
The xtian apologists actually admit these verses are said in regard to AHAZ, after 2000 YEARS, the REVISED STANDARD EDITION OF THE holy bible approved by the National Council of the CHurches of Christ in the USA, was published in 1954, and the word ‘virgin’ in ISAIH was replaced with ‘young woman’, but the fraud of mathew 1;22-23 still stands a a momument forever to the MISINTERPRETATION upon which the whole STORY was erected.
So PAUL and PETER never mentioned this virgin birth, the revised edition of the ‘scriptures’ admits ISAIH said ‘young woman’ so where do the xtians stand now? on blind faith….
All the people insulting, mocking, and basically hating on 50 shekel seem to have a lot of “Jew Pride”. I didn’t know that hatred was a good and G-dly attitude to have. I am learning more and more about Jews every day. Thanks…
Well V.G., maybe you should “learn more and more” about what Christian missionaries have done to Jews throughout history (and would do again if they had their way). Oh, and by the way, such comments as “Jew Pride” and “I am learning more and more about Jews every day” sure look like hatred to me. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
V.G. is so right. We should just sit back quietly and let Jews for Jesus decide what is and isn’t good for the Jewish community. In fact, we should follow their lead on everything.
I apologize for any comments that offended you. I guess you can just substitute the word pride, I was just trying to make a point. My response was due to my being a little upset about the comments about a friend, but your right, I shouldn’t have stooped down to the level being demonstrated on this page. Anyway, as far as the Christian missionaries, I can’t speak for anyone claiming to be a Christian, that’s between G-d and them. Any actions not G-dly or loving to any other person or thing, is not Christian, and if you didn’t know that, now you know.
Shalom
no, badchen, I have no hatred for anyone, especially Jews. I have Jewish friends and I love them. And David Kelsey, that wasn’t my point…
Well, hope we can all be more tolerant and understanding one day soon…
Can we just wipe out the hate and be loving? Is that possible? I’m willing..
G-d bless everyone reading this…
so long as christians subscribe to the precept that jews are wanton sinners doomed to hell for their refusal to adopt an ideology nothing short of a crime perpetuated against humanity; so long as they keep baptizing our deceased; so long as they keep showing up in israel and preaching to kids on street corners; so long as they keep invoking “passion plays” and asserting we killed their lord; so long as they keep hijacking american domestic policy and using it to instate a theocratic rule oppressive to women, homosexuals & minorities; so long as they keep talking about jesus’ way of love and peace while dropping bombs on brown people; so long as they keep twisting our theology and our scripture into something it’s so obviously not; i will forever remain at war with christianity.
mobius’ comment is actually pretty inventive in this otherwise hysterical thread.
the way i see it, christianity is a kind of scriptural porn. we don’t do ouselves or anyone a favor by arguing with this shekel fellow, christians or “jews” for jesus.
over at orthodox anarchist, mobius is wrestling with “radical subjectivity” and “objective truth,” observing, “Judaism is something less of a dogmatic structure imposing “the way†of an external God on us, and rather a dialectic concerned with filtering out the confusing voices of “your heart†(your wanton lusts and desires) and “your mind†(your ego-driven designs and schemes) so that you can engage in a direct conversation with God whom is innate within yourself.” i would add that it is Talmud and other traditions within Judaism that preserve this dilectic between the subjective and the objective, filtering subjective projections and reshaping the demands of objective truth via halakha.
There *are* no such institutions or intitutional instincts within Christianity. Subjective claims upon objective truth are problematical, but ultimately immaterial beside the profession of faith in Jesus. Within Christianity, one can easily observe, that the “way” is faith in Jesus more than important than the way of jesus. Lastly, and most disturbingly, there is no practical discourse between these “ways.”
That is why it makes very little sense to argue with a certain type of Christian traditionalist or fundamentalist. They have no halakha within their tradition and frequently none outside their tradition.
“forever remain at war with christianity?”….soun ds like jihad….me, I’m just at war with ha’satan…
Shalom
(P.S. most of what you’re speaking of, mobius, is not true christianity, point by point:
1. everyone is a sinner.
2. baptizing the deceased–a cult does this.
3. preaching is part of what we do
4. no one killed our Lord, he gave Himself up for us as a Holy sacrifice
5. Christianity itself is not oppressive to anyone, if people make the mistake of twisting things around and claiming to be Christian, that is against scripture and is a sin.
6. again, if their actions don’t correspond with the claim, they need to question whether they are truly Christian..
7. and finally, as far as twisting things and who’s right and who’s wrong, that is really ultimately up to the believer what to believe, we both have our opinions but whatever they may be we have to always be open to each other and be able to communicate without insults or hatred of any kind)..check out: http://www.messiahrevealed.org
have a blessed day
hey VG
i checked out your nice website.
anyone who believes that junk must be completely ignorant of the simple meaning of the Torah.
you and those like you are a bunch of idiots
who choose to be blind, to be pacified by nonsense interpretations
all who follow the false messiah jesus are obviously not really truth seekers, it’s clear as day that xtians have a corrupt interpretation and theology.
Aviad, have they stole your reason?
do you understand hebrew, the straight translation of the Tanakh? do you need ‘king james’ to translate the Torah for you?
Devarim/Deuteronomy 13;2-12
“If there shall stand in your midst a prophet…..saying”let us follow the gods of others that you did not know…” do not hearken to the words of that prophet… for H-shem your G-d is testing you, to know whether you love H-shem(only), your G-d(your only G-d) with all your heart(only Him)and with all your soul.Hash-m… shall you follow(only) and Him shall you fear(only)”
“If your brother……will entice you …saying “lets go worship the gods of others” that you did not know, you or your forefathers, from the gods of the ppl around you, those neae and those far from you….. your eye shll not pity on him, you shall not be compassionate… Rather you shall kill him, your hand shall be on him first… for he sought to stray you from H-shem your G-d”
You 50 Shekel(and those like you) are a currently a Rasha, youre a ‘Mesit’, you are not only trying to steal Jews from life in this world, but from life in the world to come.
It’s bad enough you have done this to yourself, but you are insistent on doing it to others.
I shudder to think of your punishment in the world to come, not only for damaging yourself and other people, but the immense punishment for declaring the Torah and the revelation of Sinai defunct based on conflicting “new testamonies” from men, flesh and blood, the apostates, errr, apostles. G-d declared his Torah eternal, can someone named “paul” change G-d’s word”.
You evil people perpetuate this sin, and therefore promote it, and are considered as guilty ‘paul’.
Ernast Renan called Paul’s arguments “the acme of nonsense”, “the writings of paul became a peril and hidden rock. they are the reason for the outstanding faults of xtian theology”
Thomas Jefferson termed Paul “the great corrupter” “there were other rogueries, absurdities, and untruths perptrated upon the teachings of j… by a large band of dupes ans imposters led by paul, the great cryphaeus, the first corrupter of the doctrines” ( The Missisipi Valley Historical Review, Vol. XXX No. 2)
Ernest P. Scott (Varieties of New Test. Religion, 1944) writes, “countless efforts have been made to discover in paul’s system some kind of logical cohesion, but IT IS NOW GENERALLY ADMITTED THAT IT CAN’T BE DONE. Paul’s ideas continually intersect, and FREQUENTLY CONTRADICT each other. He lays hold of any idead that immediatly suits hiss purpose, careless of how it may harmonize with what he had said alsewhere”
note- alot of the stuff im mentioning is compiled in ‘Awake My Glory ” by Avigdor Miller
You need to curb your hatred…
VG,
one more thing,
love and peace sound real nice.
but Truth sometimes includes hatred
it sometimes includes revenge,
G-d hates evil, man was created in G-d’s image.
G-d commanded us to abhor evil.
The world was created with Kindness, but it is upkept by judgement.
foolish peaceniks usually get burned.
I do hate, because I love.
This is one of the main mistakes of jesus’s theology.
I agree, but you do not have to respond with viciousness, I did not call anyone an idiot on here. We also believe in hating evil and Judgement. Standing up for what is right and fighting against evil and demonic forces. I also can understand that you hate, because you love. I on the other hand, do not hate people themselves. So I am by no means a foolish peacenik, but I have a feeling no matter what I say, you will counteract it with rabid viciousness. So since you believe you are all knowing and everyone with a different opinion is an idiot, I guess we have nothing more to say to each other. Unless, you are willing to talk like a decent human being..
Mr. Cohen can be compared to Joseph Geobbels by his spreading of racial and religious propaganda. There are more idots like him out there include this VG character. I think AC is doing a great job explaining the logic in Judaism. What these missionary morons do is not ethical. All these missionary idiots should check the facts and there where many “messiahs” at the same time as there’s including Appollonius of Tyana.
VG,
I am a firm believer in one G-d and his one word. What can I say.
Let me just ask you some questions if I may,
what is your purpose for being on this site?
are you firm in your beliefs?
are you here for answers?
are you here to give answers? to share your messianic message with ‘unsaved’ jews?
Let me give you my answers first so at least you see i’m being open and honest on this forum.
I’m a Jew
I’m sharing my views, within the confines of accepted Judaism, on current world events through my specific lens of jewish life experience.
I want to help other Jews gain insight and broaden there awareness of other Jewish viewpoints.
now its your turn VG…
50 Shekel: “I intro’d my fanbase of all ages, including 12 year old kids and above and below to Heeb a while ago…”
You go and stear 12 year olds to HEEB and that’s supposed to be HEEB’s fault?
A great example of how fundy wingnuts work. If we don’t all live in their make-believe world, then we are oppressing them. It’s all so very passive aggressive, and just as macrocosmically crazy. You want to praise Jesus? Gezunter Heyt! But keep your faith out of my face.
There is an interesting article on these morons by Robert M. Price for the Atheist Alliance titled “Kosher Pigs” http://www.atheistalliance.org…
I don’t know why everyone was blasting V.G. People are entitled to their beliefs. And I actually don’t really have a problem with individual Jews who truly don’t believe they were meant to be Jewish, and convert. My problem is with people who act like they now have the truth, and everyone else is automatically wrong.
But to V.G., also: You’re judging Jews based on an overheated Internet message board? Not very smart. 😛 I’ve heard plenty of things from individual Christians (nominally, anyway) that make my skin crawl, too. I think the fact that Jews can argue like this, and occasionally make radical or over-the-top statements, is a sign of the vitality and democracy of Judaism. I can promise you that the vast majority of Jews is not hateful, close-minded or belligerent. But this is the Internet; what can I say? 😛
And unfortunately, calling 50 Shekel a “moron,” “idiot,” etc., is only going to add to his false sense of victimhood, thus increasing his “Christian cred,” and make us look worse. I totally disagree with his beliefs, and Messianic Judaism’s actions in general, but we’re only going to lose by resorting to name-calling.
Thank you, AC. I am a Christian and I respect all people. I happen to like and respect 50 shekel and was directed to this site by his website. I also believe in One G-d and His Word. I am firm in my beliefs, but my purpose on this site at this time, was to put in my thoughts after reading some of the other posts…As far as sharing beliefs and faith, I don’t see anything wrong with it, as long as it is done gently (not bashing someone over the head with it) If I may share:
I Peter 3:15-16 — But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciousy against good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander.”
I actually just remembered a verse with the word “gentle” and went to look it up and found this scripture….how appropriate. =) AC, I do understand the passion you have for your beliefs (I have them too) unfortunately we’re on different sides of the fence, but that is no reason to hate on each other…
Flurry: thank you, you’re right, and pretty wise. Name-calling is definitely not the answer…=)
Well while I think it’s generally good for a Messianic artist to get publicity, I think it is obvious that Heeb isn’t for kids. I think people would know that Heeb has different beliefs than Messianic Judiasm (or other forms of Judaism). While I’m not sure about the content of the magazine, I think Messianic artists should only speak out against other Messianic sites they disagree with (or possibly Christian sites). If you’re going to read something that disagrees with your beliefs, you’re kinda on your own.
oh i put in a “warning” that i’m linking to my Messianic band, but since it was in brackets it didn’t show up.
“…believe that porn and Torah belong on the same page”
This is the only redeeming feature of Heeb.
“Mr. Cohen can be compared to Joseph Geobbels”
Awww, no. Did you- yeah. You went there.
May I make a suggestion? When we reach 50 kvetches on this extremely minor convert (and don’t converts always raise our blood pressure!) could we please stop and starting commenting on really important topics like whether a tomato is a fruit or a vegetable or Ms. Silverman’s cleavage? Or why my spamblock contains a British spelling variation?
Know what, as a Jew who loves and strives to serve G-d – it’s a bit shameful to see other Jews praising Heeb (which has made us look like a bunch of porno starved idiots) while in the same breath persecuting a Jew who stands up for good. More power to you Shekel! This doesn’t need to be about who Yeshua is, it needs to be about who “we” as Jews are and what type of face we want to put on our people. Want to be considered trash? Then glorify it. That’s what Heeb is doing, glorifying trash.
When I questioned his actions, his best reply to me was “You serve ha’satan…don’t waste my time”. So that is how he really feels about us guys. If you don’t believe in his idol god, then you are a satanist. I hope he is not trying to convert other Jews, because he isn’t doing a very good job of it.
More importantly, I can tell that his knowledge of Judaism is very limited. More than likely he grew up in a home that lacked much of a Jewish spirit, and his family probablly didn’t keep shabbos either (which is their business of course).
Either way, that’s the danger of growing up in a secular home… you lack the true Jewish atmosphere (Torah) to keep you Jewish. His parents failed him. (I rec’d an email from someone claiming that this was the case).
I would like to clarify one more thing… as much as I am opposed to missionaries, I am also opposed to cursing at people because you disagree with them.
Don’t forget, we disagree with what he is doing, but he is still a Jew, so treat him like one.
I know 50 Shekel personally. He was born in Tel Aviv and educated in Yeshivas. This boychik was drenched in Talmud and Torah. His parents did not fail him. Why is it so hard to just accept that Shekel has chosen this path of his own free will? It’s pretty obvious many of you are absolutely Jew in name only – secular Jews – an observant Jew would certainly not appreciate Heeb’s contribution to the downfall of Jewish society. Perhaps in the way you have chosen secularism, (without your parents failing you), Shek has chosen his path – all by himself.
No Yetzirah, I am a frum Jew thank you very much, I am as far from secular as you can get.
Secondly, I do NOT appreciate “Heeb Mag”, my point was that an idol worshiper (Aviad Cohen) need not blast a secular publication. Idolatry and ‘porn’ as you call it are equally wrong.
So, I am giving the thumbs down to both of them BUT I give 50-shekel a bigger ‘bad’ mark because he is trying to convince other Jews to abandon Judaism and follow his pagan diety J.C. Heeb might be a misquided, but they are not anti- “rabbinical judaism” like our ‘Hebrew Homeboy’ 50-shekel is.
He wants to be a bad Jew and chase after religions that have persecuted and murdered our ancestors, be my guest, that’s his business. But when he starts trying to convince young impressionable Jewish minds to follow him in jumping off the cliff, I have a serious problem with that.
50-shekel is right, are you guys blinded? Heeb magazine is whacked. Calling shek names, ain’t cool too. Holla romans 1:16 I’m not ashamed, cuz the gospel has power to save yo. Shek has found the truth. Praise G-d.
Hey, I agree that Heeb isn’t any great shakes, but I would hardly call it “pornographic” or “garbage”. Irreverence and a healthy attitude towards sexuality are some awesome parts of our heritage. While it’s more miss than hit these days, I think what they are going for is a pretty inventive juxtaposition of the sacred and the profane, which is a pretty Jewish idea. My brother Isaac said, “Judaism has two basic tendencies that manifest themselves in different ways, and sometimes seem to contradict: that of separation of good/evil, right/wrong, kosher/treyf; and that of connecting the lower to the higher and the higher to the lower… However, when we eat (eating is an animalic necessity) we do so with rule to elevate it to a higher spiritual meaning. Thus we are told not to eat standing like an animal, and are told to give thanks for our meals and often have the focal-point of our holidays be the meal itself. Mundane/frequently bad things done right become good and exceptionally good things habitualized become mundane. Basically, the sacred and profane fibers must be separated and then woven together so that one can simultaneously see the difference and the unity.”
But the main thing bothering me about all these comments is, what is this frum/secular “more Jewish than thou” thing? Has “I bet you’re secular” become the new “your mom” joke? Why can’t we disagree with someone without blaming all their wrongheadedness on some percieved lack of Yiddishkeit? Secular Jews are an important part of our heritage and don’t you forget it. Judaism is not just a matter of whether or not you like Jesus. Judaism is not a yes or no question.
Do “Ahavat Israel” also covers apostates?
Hey! I got an idea! Let’s try to convince secular Jews to embrace Jesus by talking to them in hip hop language while using Hebrew phrases as well.
How ’bout that, yo? Yoshua is like, a false messiah, ‘n’ all dis frontin is da same ole sh-t, diffrent day.
Suckahs.
Secularism is the nightmare of Judaism. Quite frankly, there is no place in “Judaism” for those who choose a path WITHOUT Hashem. Have we forgotten that we are the chosen people? And another thing, do you really think that Shek or any other Jew who has chosen to follow a different path is going to run back to Rabbinic Judaism after the way our people have treated him? Oh sure, let me go back and embrace those people who trashed me and treated me like garbage! Good idea! I don’t think so.
When you embrace a secular lifestyle, you turn your back on Hashem, you cannot have it both ways. No one is saying he is more Jewish than you, Judaism is a “nation” not a religion, but one can surely say that as a nation, we were set apart by Hashem, we were NOT set apart to be a negative example in this world, but to be a light to the goyim. Kind of difficult to be a “light” to the goyim when we smile at our Christian neighbors, befriend them, accept their friendship, accept their business, and call the One they love names when our Christian friends are not around.
Come out from among them My People. We will never be the people Hashem created us to be and set us apart to be until we reject this kind of hipocracy and embrace our G-d, turn away from the sin of this world (and everyday, not just during the high holy days).
As for Jesus, is it any wonder that he wept over Jerusalem? Rabbi Boteach put it best when he said that it is time we, as Jews embrace Yeshua for the amazing, wonderful first century Rabbi that he is, he belongs to us, first to us, then to the goyim. Then maybe we can quit being a back biting, bitter people and truly do as we are commanded “love our neighbors as ourselves”.
“Don’t forget, we disagree with what he is doing, but he is still a Jew, so treat him like one.”
Why don’t we just treat all people nicely regardless of whether they are Jewish or not Jewish. When we continue to talk like this, it gives non-jewish people ( and I hate the word goy, because no matter what anyone says that word no longer means just “non-jew”. I have never heard the word goy used in a non pergorative way) more fuel against us.
“Secularism is the nightmare of Judaism….”
Nu, a little too much schnaaps at Simchas Torah today? Judaism is the faith, Jews are the people, and they are not mutually exclusive. Secularism is only a fancy word for the sandbox we all have to share.
Mimi: “( and I hate the word goy, because no matter what anyone says that word no longer means just “non-jew”. I have never heard the word goy used in a non pergorative way)”
It means “nation,” or “a people.” It’s a neutral term, at least until you affect it with connotations. It used to be used in an internally scolding way, “a shonda fur di Goyim,” or “a shame in front of the nations.” Don’t be afraid of our own language. And that reminds me of a joke.
Two Jews are lined up against a wall before a firing squad during a pogrom. One says to the other, “You’re supposed to get a last cigarette. I shall demand my last cigarette.”
The other Jews says, “Sha! You’ll get us in trouble.”
Yetzirah: Oh sure, let me go back and embrace those people who trashed me and treated me like garbage
But ironically, 50 (and you, I’m assuming) is perfectly willing to embrace those people who trashed and mistreated his ancestors and fellow Jews.
Judaism is a “nation” not a religion
Judaism doesn’t fit neatly into modern definitions of “religion” and “nation.” However, it can definitely be classified as a religion as well as other things. Try telling the converts to Judaism that it’s not a religion.
We will never be the people Hashem created us to be and set us apart to be until we reject this kind of hipocracy and embrace our G-d, turn away from the sin of this world
Hmm, I don’t recall Jesus encouraging self-righteousness and elitism, but what do I know? I’m just an unsaved Jew!
Yes, we are commanded to love our neighbor as ourselves. But first you might consider taking the log out of your own eye. You’re peddling in easy stereotypes and mean generalizations of rabbinical Jews… I truly feel that most Jews do not call anyone “names when our Christian friends are not around.” If that’s the behavior you’ve seen, then I’m sorry, but I’m just as tired of Messianic Jews acting like they have The Truth, seeing Judaism in black-and-white, and ultimately acting extremely elitist and aggressive.
You don’t know who or what God wants me to be. So worship Jesus and worry about yourself.
It means “nation,” or “a people.” It’s a neutral term, at least until you affect it with connotations. It used to be used in an internally scolding way, “a shonda fur di Goyim,” or “a shame in front of the nations.” Don’t be afraid of our own language.
First off, I am not afraid of our own language. Just becuase I point out that some of it is fucked, doesn’t mean I fear it. Oh and sorry I did’nt write nations ( which are comprised of non-jews), I did’nt think everyone would be all tied up in Semantics on this webpage. And what I was saying is that every time I have heard the word Goy it was used in a perjorative way. Thus, you just repeated what I said, that the word has become perjorative. No where did I state that it was inherently perjorative. Furthermore, might I add, and in addition, because we keep using the word in a negative way, it no longer is a neutral word. Also, some bad words, can become good words, or used in positive ways and so their meaning to can change.
Thank You
sorry, I meant to write…. and what I was saying is that every time I hear the word goy it is used in a perjorative way, thus you just repeated what I said, by sayin that the word can become affected with connotation
Flurry, so sorry you took my post incorrectly, perhaps you should re-read it. My point has nothing to do with Jesus unless you think that Jesus is the one who tells set us apart as a ‘HOLY’ people. Hmm, funny as a Jew I always thought we were supposed to obey G-d – which would include His commandments. That would of course include the “love thy neighbor part”. Christian bashing and certainly Messianic Jew bashing is definitely no way to obey that commandment.
We have to stop this kind of behavior. We put a seriously bad face on Judaism. Jesus was no where around during the Holocaust, last I heard, he was executed about 2000 years ago. My grandparents were survivors who survived only because Christians sheltered them….go figure?
As a Karaite, I do not agree with my Orthodox brothers and sisters but neither do I sit around and trash Rambam. How in the world can we expect to find a place of respect in this world when we accept shameful and down right unG-dliness as the norm? So, the type of things portrayed as “OK” in Heeb may be just fine for you and if it is, then that’s your opinion. I think it puts a horrible face on who we really are as people.
being tolerant of other people’s faith and not bashing them doesn’t mean standing idly by as they proselytize foolish ideology to you and your children. i can accept there are great christians in the world who, through christianity, have become conscious, loving, kind individuals.
that does mean i have to respect or accept christianity as a doctrine, allow it to undermine judaism with its twisting of jewish theology, or allow the evangelicals to pull this jfj shtick when we know their the entity funding it and it’s not coming from within the jewish community itself. it’s not jews for jesus; it’s baptists for jesus for jews.
stating that fact, and calling the christian community on its bullshit doesn’t mean bashing christians or christianity. it means being honest.
bashing is ad hominem: “all christians are stupid.” you’d never hear me say that. “i don’t see how they could fall for what, to me, is so clearly a fabrication of the roman establishment,” you’ll hear all the time. that’s not bashing. that’s intellectual discourse.
Mobius, I totally agree. You have made my point. However, secularism in Judaism is the problem, not “other-faith missionaries”. Sincerely, think about this – why is it OK to go into a Jewish bookstore and see a copy of the “Jew in the Lotus” sitting on the self with other “inspirational” books when it is a book expounding the joys of Budhism? We have sunk to such a low. If our Jewish youth were in the Shul rather than in the nightclubs, if they were reading scripture rather than “Heeb” who would worry that anyone could entice them from their faith?
Do not rail against other faiths and their sincere desire to share that faith – rail against the “I’m ok – you’re ok” attitude of so many Jews.
All you have to do is read the Prophets to see that we have not changed one bit, we are still a stiff necked, rebellous people.
I think Hashem totally meant it when He said “If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their WICKED ways, then will I hear from heaven and heal their land”.
Shalom
yetzirah-
Did you actually read “Jew in the Lotus”?
I only ask because I did, and it was not a book that “expounds the joys of Buddhism”, but rather it is an exploration of one man’s judaism, the jewish experience in galus, the comparative study of two traditions, and a look into the phenomenon of Jews becoming Buddhists. It doesn’t say Jews should convert, but simply points out that it IS happening and gives some indication of why this might be taking place.
But really, what i most took from the book was Roger Kamenetz’s exploration of his own Judaism from cultural jew to practiciing and how he wished to make his observance more meaningful….what can be wrong with this my friend?
Ok, I am posting this on this site becuase everyone and their momma is reading it. City college of Manhatten is having this crazy book sale. All hardbacks are a 1.50 and all paperbacks a buck. There are getting rid of a ton of jewish history books and some books only written in Hebrew ( since I don’t read hebrew…yet, I don’t know what they are) and prayer books, and even some Gemara, all for like a dollar. I got this really really cool old Zionist book about Judea Jews fighting in Africa. Really old copy, and neat old pictures. I would buy all of the books but I’m a broke ass student, plus carrying them would be a pain. I called two shuls to see if they wanted to come buy them, but no one seemed interested ( which sorta broke my heart), seeing as one of the shuls, was pretty close to the school. The sale is only on for today, and the books won’t be available till the spring sale. If anyone has free time, a car, or wants to buy some neat looking Jewish books real cheap, city college has them, 138th and convent. Take the one or nine ( does the nine exist anymore) to 137 street. Or the AEDC ( double check that) to 145. Hope someone buys a book.
Also, if someone actually goes and buys a book, cause you post and tell me. It would make me feel so much better, I don’t know why, but I would just hate to see those books go into a dark dank storage room.
This is fairly in-line with his “style”. Can we all at least acknowledge that we called attention to the wackness long before it happened?
I don’t think prophets had such large genitals before us.
i personally still dig what heeb is doing, but then again, i would.
nope, not dead yet, sorry.
-odr
‘heeb magazine still trying ta hype my ass, so
50 shekel shake my yad or take these 10 pound brass..
shekel – i don’t know what you take me as,
can’t you see the cultural capital that ju-tang has?’
post 9-unleavened is coming…
http://www.jutangclan.com
We are always looking for books for our Shul’s library. Do you have a phone number – we are in a different state but maybe we could work something out over the phone regarding purchase and shipping. Please post a number if you have one.
Thank you!
The Jew in the Lotus – yes I read it, and the one following that teaches “Budhist/Jewish” meditation. They “are” interesting books, but have no place in a Jewish book store along side inspirational books that uplife Torah and not some other way of “other” spiritualism.
Would you freak if there were a book called “The Jew in the Church” on the shelf? Yep you would.
Yetzirah,
I guess we aren’t reading the same books, I read “Stalking Elijah” and didn’t find any teachings of Buddhist meditation. Crikey, the book was an exploration of Kamenetz delving into JEWISH MYSTICISM!
Yes I would wonder if there was a book called “The jew in the church” until i saw the name 50 Shekel listed as author…but the thing is, these books aren’t about leaving Judaism so I don’t freak out so much.
You know Elon, you are correct, the next one by that author is Stalking Elijah and I found nothing offensive in it at all. Rami Shapiro has one out called “Hasidic Tales” that is really fantastic. There is another book I picked up about Judaism and Budhism – goes into Yoga, Budhist meditation, the true nature of “G-d”. I tossed it and for some reason I thought it was by the same author as Jew in the Lotus, I was incorrect.
Jewish mysticism is one thing, if nothing else, it is the literature of our people and contains useful tid bits of history; messing around with other “gods” is another.
It’s a free world, Jews are free to do whatever they want, to worship whatever they want or whomever they want, I just truly believe it would be a much nicer world if we kind of stuck to the G-d who created us.
I am so glad someone expressed interest in these books. Ok, basically the sale is done, but in the spring there will be another sale. The number to the library is (212) 650-7155 You can call them and probebly arrange something with them. I hope it works out. You can help city college out ,and they can add to your book collection. (212) 650-7155.
Books! Are the books still available even though the sale has ended? I will be calling today. Thank you so very much.
No worries, and by the way are there any Karaite Shuls in New York. I tried looking them up, but I could’nt find any. No worries on the book. I’m just glad someone actually gives a shit enough.
I dare say that everybody who wants to obey God’s commandments will be persecuted. So 50shekel is warning about the immorality in a magazine, if you live pleasures more than you love God you will be against this, if you love God and His Tora more than pleasures you know that 50shekelis doing a right thing. Being circumcised of being a jew does not mean anything, obeying God’s commandments, having a circumsized heart is everything.
Correction
I dare say that anybody who wants to live a pious live (obey God’s commandments) will be persecuted, as Jews have been persecuted, as tru believers in the Messiah ben Joseph have been presecuted.
So 50shekel is warning about the immorality in a magazine, if you lov pleasures more than you love God you will be against this, if you love God and His Tora more than pleasures you know that 50shekel is doing a right thing. Being circumcised of being a jew does not mean anything, obeying God’s commandments, having a circumsized heart is everything.
Eric, this is very true. I could not agree with you more. The worst thing is that it is the Jews who are persecuting other “Jews” because they have chosen what they believe to be the right path. Does anyone really think persecution will entice anyone to return to traditional Judaism?
Quite frankly, I know a Christian woman who recently converted to Judaism and guess what, even though her pious Christian family and friends were saddened, they did not yell at her, scream at her, call her names, disown her and they sure aren’t persecuting her. They helped her celebrate her conversion to Judaism and I’m sure are quietly praying for her in this new walk.
No one has a right to call Shek names, to discourage him, to degrade him because of his personal choice in life. Those who do this take too much upon themselves. You place yourselves in the place of Judge and only Hashem can Judge them.
Maybe playing G-d is getting to be a bit too much for some folks. So to 50Shekel, I say Baruch Hashem that you have the chutzpa to stand up for morality as a Jew and as a Messianic Jew….
From a Karaite who is disgusted with the biggotry of my brethren
Yetz
I just made yesterday quite a lengthy comment about somebody calling Jeshua a liar, and disproved the fact that he was teaching his disciples to no wash their hands ( which can not be proven, he was using the situation to prove something more severe happend when somebody made his body unclean by his pseach)
and the false accusation that he taught his disciples to desecrate the Shabat as a holy day, which he never did, he found it acceptable to eat grain and make the seeds powder in their hands, ( is it more holy to keep people hungry) , he taught that it is allowed to save a drowning cow on Shabat ( is it holy to let it drown) and he taught it is allowed for a prophet ( and maybe a doctor) to heal somebody on Shabat ( is it more Holy to keep him sick on such a delightful day) My point was to make that his teaching for jews did not mean at all to leave the Tora, he even urged them to not break and destroy one of the least commandments of the law and the prophets. He changed me from an atheis into a God-fearing person. No I don’t believe he is Ellohim, I believe with certain talmudic writers the truth, that he is definitely so Holy that even the hebrew word that is translated with adonai was used for the Messiah. What is His name says Proverbs and what is the name of His Son if you can tell. Greetings from a life time searcher. Eric
And in searching I found that God is alive , and Jeshua is a tru teacher and prophet and I think he is the Messiah, but on the same hand I keep on searching how to obey God’s commandments and how to rely on the same time completely on the fact that I am unable and God’s grace is able and sufficient.
Eric, may G-d bless you in your decision for Yeshua. So many Jews are finding what they are looking for in Messianic Judaism. Rather than railing, Jews should be rejoicing.
I rejoice with you Eric.
Yetz
give it up guys
Thanks Yetzirah, may those lead such a life that it is provoking other Jews to jealousy