But it is the only Democracy in the Middle East!
…and they invented AIM and there are jobs there and while its people make up 0.2 percent of the world population, they represent 54 percent of the world chess champions, 27 percent of the Nobel physics laureates and 31 percent of the medicine laureates. And, and, and it is in such a bad neighborhood. Did I mention it is the only democracy in the Middle East (that deports journalists for exploiting their Jewishness to gain entry into Israel)?
Oh, wait…that isn’t the line is it? Oh well.
JTA Reports:
Israel has deported a Jewish-American journalist working for a Palestinian news agency.
Jared Malsin, the English-language editor of the Palestinian Ma’an news agency, was placed on a flight out of Israel Wednesday. He had spent the last week at an airport detention facility, according to Ma’an.
…
[Interrogation] transcripts obtained by the news service show that Malsin was considered a security risk on the basis of his political beliefs, determined by his newsstories that criticize the State of Israel. The transcripts also said, according to Ma’an, that security officials believe Malsin “exploited his Jewishness” to gain entry to Israel. (Read the whole story here.)
Our hope is not yet lost,
The hope of two thousand years,
To be a free people in our land,
The land of Zion and Jerusalem.
I remember reading an article by rabbi Kahane about a number of his followers who were denied entry to Israel. If that happened today would you protest it? Or are only anti-Israeli Jews worthy of that privilege?
fm – last I checked having views and killing people are two very different things. If Kahane’s followers were known for writing articles and blog posts about how they hated Muslims and other Arabs, then they should have been let in…but that whole murder and terrorism thing kind of puts that argument to rest. This journalist was not convicted of, connected to or cavorting with terrorism or terrorists (according to the current reports). So the analogy doesn’t work but if it did I would agree with you.
All are equal, but some are more equal than others……..
We need to stop making excuses for our own bad behavior.
See also Tikkun Olam‘s report on this from Jan 15. His article is more in depth than the JTA’s.
From what I understand, his political beliefs as seen by his writing has nothing to do with it. Of course Israeli gov’t offices are notorious for volunteering as little information as possible, leading people to conclude it was his writing that got him deported.
So, the security forces are fine releasing a transcript alleging ‘misuse of Jewishness’ but are not willing to articulate a specific security threat?
I want to see more about misuse of Jewishness. Perhaps a law….
So they deported one guy for saying things they didn’t like. Who cares. They also banned an entire party (you all know which one) thus disenfranchising an entire bloc of voters. It all depends on whose ox is being gored.
You can’t expect the fallout from Israeli anti-democratic actions to be restricted to the right wing.
fm-
what don’t you realize? they didn’t ban any party, they banned a party whose basic platform was one advocating violence and whose members had been implicated in murders. Banning the Kach party was more than about restricting right wing politics, it was about restricting institutionalized violence as a valid basis for a political party.
It is a big deal when a democratic nation kicks out its citizens because that is not in line with democratic values. this is just another example that Israeli governance, if it is democracy, is not based in democratic values.
This ain’t the half of it. The Jerusalem police just arrested and detained over Shabbes the director of Israel’s ACLU for trumped up charges. He was lucky; many of his other employees and supporters have been beaten.
And the Interior Ministry is now denying visas to foreign workers of aid organizations including Oxfam, Doctors without Borders, and Save the Children.
Bibi Netanyahu’s administration is taking Israel deeper into an ugly place where state instruments are used against human rights workers and orgs. Russia does this. China does this. Iran does this. We expect it of them. I do not expect this of Israel and whatever claim its defenders used to have to democratic freedoms is slipping down the slope.
Justin, that didn’t seem to be an issue the first time Kahane was elected to the knesset.
A law was made directed toward one specific party. The supreme court made sure of that. Despite the fact the the law also banned parties who advocate the end of Israel as a Jewish state. Did Israel ban any arab parties lately?
they put out a motion to, yes. it was blogged about here, and was pretty widely reported on in the israeli media. the thing is, the supreme court decided that the parties in question were not advocating for violence and as far as I know there is no party in knesset right now which holds by a platform calling for the destruction of the jewish state. i could be wrong, i am certainly not up to date in any capacity on israeli politics, i’ve checked out for too many months
Israel has full right to deny or accept the request to pass its borders. Israel can say “no” to anybody if it choses to, especially to those who spit in its face and do anything possible to taint it with lies, fabrications and distorsions of facts.
Jared Malsin may have never comitted a traffic violation but this does not secure him ANY kind of automaitc right to enter Israel.
Let’s see how many Israeli Jews who have never committed any traffic violation would be allowed into Saudi Arabia with the purpose of demonizing it. For that matter, let’s see ANYBODY being let into Saudi Arabia with the same purpose.
Let this creep go into Gaza through one of the tunnels
So any policy that a party advocates that might require future violence, say national defence, automatically disqualifies that party from running?
I know, that was the mother of all strawmen. Nonetheless, kach’s platform, calling for the transfer of arabs out of Israel, is not equivalent with advocating violence. Money also works.
Jesus effing Shabbetai on a Walking Stick, you REALLY refuse to budge.
Ka”kh was not banned for spreading an ideological message, it was banned for being involved in terrorism. (Perhaps ironic due to the founding parties of Israel being involved in terrorism themselves.) The messianist RZ faction of the Israeli populace can still vote for parties who follow similar ideologies. Provided, of course, they don’t get involved in terrorist activity.
James, I suppose your standard for Israel is to be just like Saudi Arabia in terms of treating pesky journalists.
Jesus effing Shabbetai on a Walking Stick, you REALLY refuse to budge.
Ka”kh was not banned for spreading an ideological message, it was banned for being involved in terrorism. (Perhaps ironic due to the founding parties of Israel being involved in terrorism themselves.) The messianist RZ faction of the Israeli populace can still vote for parties who follow similar ideologies. Provided, of course, they don’t get involved in terrorist activity.
Dear formermuslim,
Even though I wouldn’t vote for Meir Kahane, I understand your point, and it isn’t too hard to understand.
Btw, the Kach party was banned from running in the 1988 election when Labor and Likud–looking at the polls that showed Kahane doing very well in the 1988 elections–got together to revise the Knesset elections law so that they could prevent Kach from running. That’s just what happened, for good or bad, right or wrong.
The entire Kach movement was later banned after the Baruch Goldstein Massacre in 1994.
FM, I really suggest that you might want to stick to just reading Jewschool, because non-“company-line” comments usually aren’t addressed intelligently here . . . as we’re about to see.
I disagree J1, I think in most cases they do actually follow intelligent, mature conversations. I think it is also very clear that formermuslim comes here to comment with the explicit intention of annoying people rather than adding to any conversation. I also think it’s pretty unfair to say there is a “party line,” it seems to me that there is much nuance to people’s opinions, and I cannot think of having seen two Jewschool contributors replicate identical ideas or philosophies. Could you point out any examples?
Let’s just say that if Mr. Maslin were to move to Yitzhar and run a settler news agency from there, nothing would happen to him. Look at Jack Titel!
I think in most cases they do actually follow intelligent, mature conversations. I think it is also very clear that formermuslim comes here to comment with the explicit intention of annoying people rather than adding to any conversation
Well, Justin, I can’t look into fomermuslim’s heart or mind, but I’m not sure how you can be sure of his/her intentions here.
If we look at this post, I think that dcc is arguing that Israel, as a self-proclaimed “enlightened” society, is being hypocritical in banning a journalist because of his political views . . . fair enough, I can’t argue with that.
Then, I think formermuslim is pointing out that there is a bit of hypocracy here because most Jewschoolers likely would have supported banning Kach from running in the 1988 election–a ban which happened because of Kach’s platform (it really happened because Labor and Likud got scared of Kahane’s power when they saw the polling numbers.) Still, ostensibly, Kach was prevented for running because its platform–forcibly expelling civilians–might lead to violence, or was a racist (I forget the exact reasoning.) That’s a bit ironic considering that the Likud party–which was so instrumental in stopping Kahane from winning big in ’88– has twice had its hand in the forcible expulsion of civilians (1982 and 2005) . . . that’s a pretty reasonable point by fm. It’s also ironic because every Knesset party (other than Hadash) can easily be classified as racist.
But, now fm is stuck explaining why he/she is not simply “attentionally annnoying people,” or “Jesus effing Shabbetai on a Walking Stick, you REALLY refusing to budge,” instead of defending his/her position. Even more, why would anybody’s true intentions even matter, regarding a debated issue?
(I support the Egypt treaty and the Disengagement, btw. See, I have to write that so that I won’t have to defend being a lurking “Kahanist.”)
I also think it’s pretty unfair to say there is a “party line,” it seems to me that there is much nuance to people’s opinions, and I cannot think of having seen two Jewschool contributors replicate identical ideas or philosophies. Could you point out any examples?
As a long-time Jewschool (and Justin) fan, there seems to be a pretty solid consensus regarding the state of Israel and its actions. That’s fine by me, but I’d call that “company line.”
I will give you that many contributors and ocmmentors at Jewschool share a loose political ideology (and I’m not sure if that’s totally accurate) this is a blog for “Progressive Jewish views on religion, politics and culture” according to its own definition of itself. So is it that there is a company line or that when it was created by Mobius, this was intended as an on-line community for people who, especially at the time, were being ostracized by the ‘mainstream’ and institutional Jewish community for their political views. That this is a self-identified progressive on-line community, it shouldn’t surprise readers to find progressive political views espoused by contributors and likewise find defense of those progressive values in the face of critique. But I also think in most cases people respect one another, while there are always the downfalls of an on-line anonymous forum.
But if you go through and look into comments put forth by formermuslim, they tend to be in a certain tone and of a certain nature. I cannot look into this person’s mind, but I can interpret and analyze their words.
I understood BBN’s exclamation (which I found beautiful and hilarious) to be not in reaction to formermuslim’s beliefs or thoughts, but rather in the insistence on maintaining a false analogy and not acknowledging the true nature of the ban on ka”kh in relation to this event. And recognizing that journalists hold a special responsibility and that responsibility comes with certain privilege in democratic societies, and according to democratic values a democracy is limited in its ability to censure or censor journalists. this is a very different thing than banning a political party which was guilty of advocating violence and whose members were involved in terrorism.
and you have to wonder why someone who generally holds by conservative views and values would regularly read and comment on a progressive blog
but rather in the insistence on maintaining a false analogy and not acknowledging the true nature of the ban on ka”kh in relation to this event. And recognizing that journalists hold a special responsibility and that responsibility comes with certain privilege in democratic societies, and according to democratic values a democracy is limited in its ability to censure or censor journalists. this is a very different thing than banning a political party which was guilty of advocating violence and whose members were involved in terrorism.
But the analogy isn’t a false one, and fm is referring to Kach being prevented from running in the 1988 elections, not its outright ban resulting from the 1994 Goldstein Massacre (unless Shamir and Peres had some secret information on Goldstein in 1988, or maybe a time-machine.)
So is it that there is a company line or that when it was created by Mobius, this was intended as an on-line community for people who, especially at the time, were being ostracized by the ‘mainstream’ and institutional Jewish community for their political views. That this is a self-identified progressive on-line community, it shouldn’t surprise readers to find progressive political views espoused by contributors and likewise find defense of those progressive values in the face of critique.
Ok. So we’re saying the same thing. I just think that the defense of those views crosses the line of respectful too often–maybe I’m guilty of that myself.
It’s just a very unfortunate part of the blogging world; people wouldn’t be talking like this to one another face-to-face.
“It’s just a very unfortunate part of the blogging world; people wouldn’t be talking like this to one another face-to-face.”
totally. it is a shame, all we can do is really watch ourselves and respectfully call people out when need be and do the best we can to be respectful
To Kung: You state “This ain’t the half of it. The Jerusalem police just arrested and detained over Shabbes the director of Israel’s ACLU for trumped up charges. He was lucky; many of his other employees and supporters have been beaten.”
Reality Check PLEASE!
How ’bout we get the facts strait. I was there and I will be there again today.
It was a demonstration against the takeover of housing by Jewish settlers in the Sheikh Jerrah neighborhood in East Jerusalem.
We were there without a police permit (for complicted technical reasons). The police had the right make arrests. What we did was morally correct but technically it was illegal.
The exaggeration is that they did not NEED to make arrests. They did not NEED to keep anyone in jail over Shabbat. It was an attempt to discourage free speech.
But the police did nothing illegal.
The organization is called ACRI (Association for Civil Rights in Israel).The person arrested was Hagai El-Ad.
But you also state: “He was lucky; many of his other employees and supporters have been beaten.”
How many? I was there and saw none! Not one! The complaint filed by ACRI against the police did not mention his “many emplyees who were beaten.” Why? because none of his employees were beaten.
You want to make a point-that is your right. But do not bolster your contention with imagined information. I agree with the protesters and disagree with the police actions. But please-find the name of any ACRI employee who was beaten by police.
see:http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:E1DaW4owT24J:www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite%3Fcid%3D1263147941839%26pagename%3DJPost%252FJPArticle%252FPrinter+acri+arrest+sheich+east+jerusalem+friday+protes&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=il&client=firefox-a
Imagined? Not unless my friends and coworkers who have been attending those rallies for long enough have been imagining them. I’m sure my friend littlerose (a commentor here) would tell you the black eye and concussion her coworker received a few weeks ago at those rallies is totally imagined.
Talk about jumping to conclusions. Those protests have been going on for weeks.
Finding out that Ka”kh was “really” banned for being an upstart 3rd party actually puts a fresh perspective on things. It’s also a lesson to would-be extreme right wing parties: Do the Liberman and cleave to the moderate right, or face the same fate.
It’s also a lesson to would-be extreme right wing parties: Do the Liberman and cleave to the moderate right, or face the same fate.
Really? I always thought Kahane had the only coherent, honest right-wing platform (on the Zionist spectrum of Right/Left.)
The other parties never make any sense to me. They want to keep the territories, build more settlements, and pretend that (1) millions of other human beings aren’t living there (Likud), or (2) that they’ll disappear if we close our eyes and pray hard enough (Mafdal), (3) or that they’ll be content to live under “autonomy” (the Begins) or that (4) Jordan will take civil control of the West Bank’s population, but we’ll keep Jerusalem and the Jordan Valley Rift (old Labor,) etc., etc.
To Kung: YES! IMAGINED on your part or the part of your friends. Rely if you will on second hand reports from friends.
Here is the written reaction to the question “Beyond your arrest were any ACRI employees beaten, hit, injured, or hassled physically by the police?
You state: “He was lucky; many of his other employees and supporters have been beaten.”
Hagai El Ad, the ACRI director responds: “אף עובד של האגודה לא הוכה.”
So again I would urge you to report the facts without embellishments.
Others were slightly injured but NONE of his employees. Period.
So please, I challenge you to name even one ACRI employee who was beaten or to modify your statement and be more careful in the future.
How exactly is Lieberman the moderate right?